Knocking down stub walls

[brnhornt]

Hi gang.

I'm about to embark on a flooring project and wanted to pose this question. Pictured is my dining room and living room. I understand the builder wanting to seperate the two with the header/stub walls back in the day...but we'd really like to open the space up.



My question...is how can I determine if those stub walls are in any way load bearing? When I tap...it's just hollow drywall from the connecting wall out to a single stud at the end. It's a long span, and the floor joists run parallel with the long wall on the left....so I don't doubt there is some kind of beam/header in that ceiling "bump"....and I/we can live with that...

So how best to proceed? Just go at it with a sledge hammer/sawzall? Or is there a better/correct way to make sure I'm not going to knock them out and then the upstairs bedroom becomes a first floor master....

Thanks!
Kevin

[Humanbackhoe]

Hey Kevin....A bearing wall will have a similar wall beneath it, which transfers the weight straight down to the footings and/or post and beam framing....


As far as removal...The outlets, light switches, thermostats and vents will need careful handling to be rerouted or discontinued properly. Cut the ceiling/wall and wall/ wall joints so your demolition does not spread out of desired area...a utility knife will cut the caulk paint and drywall tape just fine.

Use a Sawsall and make a horizontal cut about midway through all studs and drywall. Wiggle the debris free...easy. Two people could carry larger demo panels to the trash....if its just you, cut them into a comfortable size to carry away......


Andrew

[Cooler]

Humanbackhoe said:

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Hey Kevin....A bearing wall will have a similar wall beneath it, which transfers the weight straight down to the footings and/or post and beam framing....

Andrew

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In a ranch house too? I have one steel I-beam that runs the length of the basement. Are you saying that the walls directly over that beam are the only load bearing walls in the house?

I would strip off the sheet rock that appears to shroud a couple of 2" x 12" rafters. If they are in place I would assume that it is load bearing. If it is a false facade than it would not be load bearing.

If it is two 2" x 12"s then you will have to know some engineering. You are increasing the span, if you don't want to increase the depth of the facade you might have to use an engineered lumber alternative. They can carry greater loads. Gluelam and LVL are the ones I have read about. But there are many others. The nice thing about these is that they are almost always perfectly true and straight.

[JGrout]

Quote:

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In a ranch house too? I have one steel I-beam that runs the length of the basement. Are you saying that the walls directly over that beam are the only load bearing walls in the house?

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I doubt even the upper walls are load bearing walls unless there are Lally columns going down to the basement floor along the steel. even then they may just be there to keep the upper floor from bouncing too much

Most houses built With truss rafters systems for a good long time have four load bearing walls..........

They are the perimeter of the house

the correct way to determine a load bearing wall IME is to look at the roof structure not the basement

[Robert Adams]

You climb up in the attic and see what is supporting the roof. I wish all builders would use trusses. Makes life so much easier when remodeling.

[brnhornt]

If it helps...house was built in mid-late eighties....right around 30 years old.

[Curlycherry]

Best way to find out is open up the drywall. This is a job that was made for the Fein Multimaster or a similar multitool. Cut the drywall pieces out at an angle and they can be mudded and stuck back in and patched very easily. Open it up and see what is in that wall. That is the only way to be 100% absolutely certain.

My bet is it is not load bearing.

[Snipe Hunter]

Is this a single story or a two story.?

Does that wall continue through other rooms on the same level?

What is directly under the wall? A basement? A slab? Another story? Lolly columns?

What is above it? An attic or another story?

If it's an attic, do you have engineered trusses or another type of structure? If you have engineered trusses, are they running parallel to the wall or perpendicular to the wall?

Is their any HVAC equipment or a water heater on top of it in the attic?

The answers to these questions will tell us if it's load bearing.

If it's not load bearing and you decide to remove it. Cut the corner drywall joints all around it first, then pull off the sheetrock before you attack it with a sawzall. Nothing worse than sawing through live wires or supply piping.
Have you looked above it to see if the wall is being used as a chase for plumbing/vent pipes, drain pipes or ducting?

[Cooler]

If it is not load bearing I would get rid of the false facade entirely and make it all flush to the ceiling.

[brnhornt]

Sorry guys...got stuck on a work project and couldn't reply...

But...this is a two story home with a 3/4 finished basement. I say 3/4 because the utility room and my handy-man shop area is unfinished.

Directly above these two rooms are the master bedroom and bathroom.

I just snapped a picture of the basement directly below:


I measured from the outside wall (behind me in each picture) and that steel beam runs in between the last two chairs in the first picture.

The studwall in the basement (the start of the finished section) is about 3-4 inches closer to the outside wall (behind me) in the first picture than these stub walls.

So if I am looking at all of that correctly...it should mean that these two stub walls are simply sitting on the subfloor and not anything structural right?

Side note....when I tap on the horizontal facade (call it a kind of possible beam enclosure) it sounds hollow to me as well.

Not too easy to get into the attic here...it's just a small access port...but I'm 95% sure that the last time I was up there...this area (above the master bedroom/bath) has trusses...running perpendicular to the two stud walls. If it needs a picture...I'd be happy to haul my fat rear up there.

Thanks again guys!