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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Restoring an Old Electrical Motor
      #4983297 - 07/30/10 03:00 PM

This is a spinoff thread from my long thread on Restoring an Old Drill Press. Since motors are much more general than just for DPs, it makes sense to give it it's own space so that it can go in whatever direction is appropriate about old motors.

The motor I'm working on is a nice 1/2hp single phase 1750 rpm Walker-Turner motor. IIRC, these were made by Kingston-Conley, who made motors for a lot of manufacturers. These are very highly regarded motors, heavy, solid, and attractive. The tags have a very nice design, and the little mounting feet that are built into the endbell castings are just way too cool. These motors are also famous for their "crinkled" paint jobs on the endbells.

In any event, I need to get the motor apart to clean out the insides and to replace the bearings. I've done a dozen or two motors over the years, a number of different sizes, styles, manufacturers, etc., but am only mediocre at best at this. There are a lot of real experts out there who know these things inside and out.

Here is the motor as I'm ready to start. If all goes well, it should take maybe an hour to get it apart at least to the point of getting the bearings off. But every motor has its idiosyncrasies, so no telling how long or what will be involved if it's not straightforward. That's probably likely.





Since I'm going to be ordering bearings, I'm hoping to pull these two others apart as well to order bearings for all... a 1/2hp Craftsman and a 1/3hp Delta. Delusions of grandeur, best laid plans, and all that...



Looking at this a little closer, the two cast iron end bells have little screws, probably set screws of some sort, for some reason, in locations where you typically see oiler holes for sleeve bearing motors. No idea what they're for on this one.



First things first, make alignment marks on the endbells and the center band for reassembly later. The components need to go back together exactly as they came apart. Most folks probably use a punch to make dimples, I prefer to use a drill to be a little more gentle. Just be sure not to drill through anything... a little mark is all that's needed. I also try to do them on the lower back area rather than out in the visible sides.





Remove the tie rods that pull the three major sections together. The design of these can take many forms. Most times, you'll find through rods with some form of hex cap or slotted head on one end and a nut on the other. These have threaded sections for nuts on both ends. Some motors don't use through rods, but use machine screws on both endbells that are threaded into the main housing.





Now, to pry the endbells loose. For the record, I'm showing using a wooden block as a tapper. Others, ahem, may use a punch, a screwdriver, a stud, whatever... but for purposes of this thread, I'll make the point that it is recommended not to use any steel device when tapping against cast iron. On this particular motor, the edge of the endbells stand slightly higher than the center band... that's a good thing. On some, most notably a lot of old Deltas (see the one above), the endbells are lower than center band so there is nothing to get a bite on to tap against. Discussion of how to approach those is left to other posts.



Anyways, you need to work your way around the edges of both endbells and gradually work them loose. Sometimes it can be productive to use the motor shaft to drive against the opposite endbell, but don't get carried away.



Success on one end, at least to the point where now I can get a screwdriver in and pry it loose a bit more easily.



A little more work in the other direction and both endbells are loosened somewhat, tho neither is yet off.



Working on the end that does not have all the electricals, one endbell comes right off, leaving the bearing on the shaft.



Now things get more complicated as we turn to the end with the electricals and the enclosed (blind) bearing well. These can be a real PITA. The leads from the motor are going to be connected to the contacts and centrifugal switch, which is going to be bolted to the endbell. That's pretty much a given. That means the endbell won't be able to pull very far from the center section because the leads will bind. Let's see what's up.

First, I notice for the first time that the design on this motor brings the start winding to and from the capacitor through a port in the endbell. That means we have to remove the capacitor if I want to completely remove the endbell. Damn. I much prefer leaving the capacitor attached when it's connected through the center section, and just tape it off for painting. Can't do that here.



Look inside the cap and see that the leads are soldered on rather than spade connectors. Not a surprise, but double-damn. Get the soldering gun and disconnect them. It was possible to just cut the wire for now, but since I'll have to resolder them eventually I might as well do it right... especially since the wire leads sometimes don't have much excess length.





Now let's look at what's going on with other aspects of the wiring. First, inside the junction box. This is really funky and a mess. I have no idea what's up with all of these connectors, jumpers, etc., but need to take a couple photos because it may matter later. It is certainly not the straightforward set of leads usually seen.





Now, to the endbell with all the circuitry. The working space is only about an inch gap, maybe two. Inside, there are two small slotted head machine screws that attach the switch to the endbell.



It's always a pain to get to these screws, and especially so when (a) you don't have much working room, and (b) you don't want to stress old crusty wiring. Fortunately, the cloth wiring in this one is pretty solid and has some flex, so I can stretch it to its max length. First, I took a couple of 90-degree screwdrivers to see if I could reach in and work from a right angle... nope, neither quite fit/reached. So then I took a long thin flat screwdriver to see if I could get to the heads. Sort of, but the tip couldn't get a bite on the screw head. Off to the grinder to sharpen/thin the screwdriver head to get a little better grip. Finally, they both slowly can be rotated out and removed.



You can't tell it from this photo, but the entire circuitry assembly is now free from the endbell. Whew, that means the endbell is free to come off the rotor shaft, assuming either the bearing will pull out of the well or the shaft will come out of the bearing, leaving the bearing in the well. Either way, it's finally ready to come off.

Twist, tap, pry, lube, curse, nope... that sucker's stuck in there. And I still can't see much because one wire seems to be binding, which keeps me from taking the endbell WITH the rotor out in the direction of the endbell. Trace that wire back, and we find that it's one of the leads that come into the j-box. This thing is really starting to kick my butt, but fine, let's pull that lead out of the j-box wiring and let it go with the switch.





Finally, the endbell and rotor are free to pull from the main housing and armature. Ughh... that's much uglier than I was expecting to see, considering the nice condition of the motor's exterior.



And a much better view inside that endbell. All the electrical components are disconnected, and I cannot see or feel a retaining screw that you sometimes find as a bearing retainer. Does anybody know if I'm missing something in there? The bearing/shaft just does not want to come out. The rotor assembly wobbles/rocks a little bit back and forth, but won't pull out.



It's a blind well, as seen here from the outside, so there's no way to get at it from the other side to tap it out.



So that's where I'm at. As I said, this thing is kicking my butt at the moment. From another post in the main DP thread, it seems that the shaft should most likely slide out of the bearing rather than the bearing come out of the well. That also makes sense because it would account for the shaft being able to wiggle somewhat. But it ain't happened yet, so I came in to take a break and look for some more info on this. It doesn't look like I'll be ordering bearings today.

More later.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Jonny Rocket
Member

Registered: 09/01/06
Posts: 1082
Loc: Peoria, IL
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983369 - 07/30/10 04:15 PM

Can you rotate and/or lift the switch to see the actual bearing? At any rate the shaft of the rotor should come out now. If it were me, I'd hold the rotor and whack the end bell with a plastic hammer. Patience is in short supply in my shop though.

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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Jonny Rocket]
      #4983403 - 07/30/10 04:48 PM

Jonny Rocket said:

If it were me, I'd hold the rotor and whack the end bell with a plastic hammer.



Ding, ding, ding... we have a winner. Wooden mallet actually, took about 10 seconds. Buckeroo had said the same thing. I just needed to make sure there wasn't a retaining screw behind that plate where I couldn't see anything. BTW, Buckeroo, that plate on the centrifugal switch does, indeed, sit on top of the brass ring (i.e., switch side), not underneath it. Sounds like yours has a problem.





Now to try and pull the bearing out. I knew I had read somewhere about a little homemade rig for doing this, and Buckeroo reminded me that it was one of Bob Vaughan's incredibly cool posts, as usual.

http://owwm.org/viewtopic.php?t=48112

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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MrMhor
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Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 1184
Loc: Rockford, IL
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983405 - 07/30/10 04:50 PM

I take it those two screws on the housing aren't holding the bearing in the bell.

Cheers,
Andrew


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: MrMhor]
      #4983411 - 07/30/10 04:55 PM

That's kind of what we figure they do. There's just a fraction of an inch of the back side of the outer race that comes into that hole. So they must be some form of little set screw, but they can't do much since it's at most 1/16" bite on the outermost edge. Actually, as I think about it more, they're more likely to be a stop to keep the bearing from going too far into the well, as opposed to a set screw to hold it in place.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983478 - 07/30/10 06:07 PM

Got it. That bugger was in there. I first tried to do something along the lines that Bob's owwm thread showed, but the bearing was too small to find any respectable washer that would even fit through the bore. There was no way a tiny washer would ever tolerate enough force that would be necessary to be successful.

As usual, start by cleaning up the mating surfaces and drench with penetrant.



So next, it's time to look around the various drawers and parts bin. Aha, how about these inside calipers with little hooks on the end? Stick them in through the bore, open them up, and yank on them, beat on the endbell, see what happens.





What happens? The cast iron and bearing get a little chuckle out of the feeble attempt, bend the calipers, and say "next?" Ok, so I'm gonna have to smack it with something. How about one of those 90-degree drivers I was using before? This one just barely squeezes through the bore and pivots up to lever against the back side of the bearing. This has promise.





After a couple dozen whacks, starting to seem hopeless, suddenly there's an ominous/promising POP. Hope that wasn't the endbell. Take a close look, woohoo, movement!



Renewed enthusiasm at last. A couple whacks, rotate the endbell 90 degrees, a couple more, rinse & repeat. <trumpets please>



And we're out.



Whereas progress the other day on the drill press was way faster and more successful than expected, this effort gave it all back. The conclusion: you never know how it's going to go. But the good news is, I now have both bearings accessible, and I need to go pull the other one off the shaft. That'll come next.

I hope y'all don't mind my rambling on about this stuff... I'm just laying out my thoughts and ideas, just slightly more organized than stream of consciousness. Comments and suggestions are always appreciated.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Jonny Rocket
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Registered: 09/01/06
Posts: 1082
Loc: Peoria, IL
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983547 - 07/30/10 07:07 PM

My one encounter with a stuck bearing came out with some long jawed vise grips:



Note: I wasn't trying to save that bearing. I pried the shield off and pulled it out.

Bill, I think those screws might be grease points? Are the bearings open on the sides facing the screws?


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Buckaroo
Missed it by >< much

Registered: 02/25/05
Posts: 6031
Loc: Amana, Iowa(sort of)
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983568 - 07/30/10 07:22 PM

Outstanding!
Had to laugh about the calipers. I could see me trying that approach...if I'd have been able to find some. Both you guys are creative. I can be, but I got frustrated and gave up so bought the puller instead.
Always good to see how others skin the proverbial cat.

--------------------
Buck

Business Meetings - None of us is as dumb as all of us.


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Jonny Rocket]
      #4983613 - 07/30/10 08:19 PM

Jonny Rocket said:

Note: I wasn't trying to save that bearing. I pried the shield off and pulled it out.

Bill, I think those screws might be grease points? Are the bearings open on the sides facing the screws?



Nice, Jonny. I wasn't trying to save the bearing either, and was just a couple minutes away from pulling out the Dremel and cutting my way through the bearing. I didn't think of removing the shield, but I don't think I'd have been able to just pull the bearing out anyways because of how adhered it was. I'm still working to clean up the inside of those castings. Nasty.

The bearings are shielded on both sides, and the well is hollow behind the bearing. They're certainly not for grease or oil. The bearing in the blind well sits against a shoulder in the back, so there's no reason for the screw to be a stop... I guess it must be a little safety precaution against the bearing outer race spinning in the retainer.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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oakey
Member

Registered: 02/01/10
Posts: 1154
Loc: mich.thumb
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983699 - 07/30/10 09:36 PM

bill
those blind brg. pullers are the cats meow for that job.
harbour freight used to have pilot brg. pullers probably still have them.
i have cupple diffrent stiles made buy OTC one is two jaws the other just a hook tool some what like you used but heavy duty .they are used on a small slide hammer
Otc also has push pullers that you can put blind hole pullers on and pull brgs.
im enjoying the great job your doing with both the posts edit to add this
bill are the set screws used to set the rotor end play ??I do not see them in the picture but just wondering seeing as you explain they just set partualy in the bottom of the brg. bore

Edited by oakey (07/31/10 08:37 AM)


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: oakey]
      #4983806 - 07/31/10 12:30 AM

Thanks Oakey, I'm always kinda wondering if anyone other than the few of us who are posting have any interest. It feels pretty weird rambling on like some of these posts do, and just replying to myself. Oh well... on we go.

So having gotten through that major hassle, we're getting back on track. Use a bearing puller to pull the other bearing off the rotor shaft, no problem there.





The two bearings turn out to be different sizes, which I haven't seen all that often, compared to motors with the same bearings on both ends. The smaller one, which was in the blind well, is an SKF 6301 and the larger one from the shaft is an MRC 203. According the Accurate Bearing Parts Interchange site both of those should be readily available off-the-shelf bearings.



Spend a little time cleaning up the other internal parts, starting with chucking up the rotor assembly in the lathe. First do the main rotor, centrifugal switch, and shaft end, then turn it around and do the other. It cleans up ok with some WD40 and a scotchbrite.





Next up is the switch contact device. I can't remember having had to disconnect one of these from the motor leads before, but that's the result of this afternoon's problems. This part works in conjunction with the centrifugal switch that is seen on the one end of the rotor shaft above. I'll show how those work together later when I put the whole thing back together... uh, assuming I'm able to get to that point.



We often hear people ask questions about why a motor just hums or buzzes when they try to start it up. Frequently the answer is to blow out the starter or the end of the motor with the contacts. If blowing it out doesn't work, then the next step is to pull the switch and clean up corroded contacts. Here are a couple shots of the starter contacts and the quick approach to sanding them back to conductive surfaces.

These are the start contacts open, which is the state while the motor is running.



These are the contacts closed, which is the state while the motor is off.



To clean the surfaces, I just take a piece of 320 grit sandpaper, fold it in half to use both surfaces, insert it between the contacts and hold them lightly closed, and slide the sandpaper around a little bit.



Finally, the switch is cleaned and the contacts freshened up. Note that the two wires are taped and labeled to show where they go respectively when reassembled... the one labeled "switch" being that problematic one that goes to the junction box, and the other one to the start capacitor.



Thanks all. Now on to prepping the motor parts for painting, hopefully tomorrow.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Warptboard
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Registered: 01/12/07
Posts: 1281
Loc: Minnehaha Creek, MN
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983926 - 07/31/10 07:48 AM

Groovy thread

More pics! More pics!!


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rsstreet
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Registered: 03/18/08
Posts: 133
Loc: Mt Juliet, TN
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Warptboard]
      #4983947 - 07/31/10 08:21 AM

Nice thread Bill. Definitely following along.

Randy


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SceneryMaker
The Quiet Member

Registered: 10/23/08
Posts: 3838
Loc: Indiana
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983996 - 07/31/10 09:17 AM

skizzo said:

I'm always kinda wondering if anyone other than the few of us who are posting have any interest. It feels pretty weird rambling on like some of these posts do, and just replying to myself.




PLEASE continue with these updates. Consider that this post already has 241 views in the 18 hours it has been up, with a title that nobody would open accidentally. In other words, you have an audience that cares about what you are doing, even if we are not vocal about it. For that, I apologize. It is probably taking more time and effort to document and post the process than it takes to do the work, so thank you and keep it up.

--------------------
To the engineer, the world is a toybox, full of sub-optimized and feature-poor toys.


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TK'sDust
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Registered: 09/25/02
Posts: 1178
Loc: Woodinville, WA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4983999 - 07/31/10 09:22 AM

Nice pictorial on an older motor with it's challenges. It's going nice with my morning coffee...

--------------------
TK


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: SceneryMaker]
      #4984067 - 07/31/10 11:13 AM

SceneryMaker said:

It is probably taking more time and effort to document and post the process than it takes to do the work, so thank you and keep it up.



Thanks for the feeback, guys, that's good to know. I got a couple PMs as well, much appreciated. And nobody's called me a crackpot yet, either, so I took that as a good sign.

I've always taken a lot of photos on my projects... both woodworking and machines... but have never chronicled them as I went along. It turns out that the time to document is almost exactly equal to the time doing the work. An hour or two of work takes an hour or two to manage photos and put up a post, etc. It's not a surprise at all and I expected it going in, but I think it's interesting that it's pretty much a 1:1 relationship every time.

Gotta do a BORG run for supplies (wire wheels and scotchbrites), then plan to get the motor parts painted today and the base/column cleaned. I know I can't replicate the WT crinkled black, so I'm going to use black satin on the endbells and black gloss on the center band. I got them cleaned and stripped last night, so only have a bit of taping and final prep before painting.

Thanks again.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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oakey
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Registered: 02/01/10
Posts: 1154
Loc: mich.thumb
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4984232 - 07/31/10 02:33 PM

Bill
yes you can replicate the finnish its called wrinkle paint just google it one co is plastikote.com avalible from some auto parts stores. of course regular old paint going to be nice to .
waiting to see this finnished keep up the posts


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SceneryMaker
The Quiet Member

Registered: 10/23/08
Posts: 3838
Loc: Indiana
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4984322 - 07/31/10 05:13 PM

skizzo said:


I know I can't replicate the WT crinkled black






Just practice on some scrap first because the coarseness of the texture is governed by how thick you apply it. I've used this and it works.

--------------------
To the engineer, the world is a toybox, full of sub-optimized and feature-poor toys.


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Anak
Stranger

Registered: 08/06/06
Posts: 10803
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Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4984366 - 07/31/10 06:12 PM

Very cool thread (or threads, as I also appreciate the DP teardown).

It's no crackpot who can figure out how to disassemble and rehabilitate old rusty equipment.

Another tool to add to the "toolbox" for pulling out those blind bearings would be the simple trick my grandfather taught me for pulling pilot bearings: Pack the blind hole with grease and then drive the bearing outward by driving the grease inward with a dowel or solid rod of the correct diameter.

Sizing the dowel/rod correctly is not always as easy as it sounds, but the technique has worked for me, and it is fairly low tech and doesn't require much in terms of fancy tools. If it gets someone out of a bind once it pretty much pays for itself.

--------------------
Every decision you make can be viewed as a choice between comfort and opportunity.

Just when we start having fun they send in the lawyers.


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Brian in Boise
Member

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 102
Loc: Boise, Idaho
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4984431 - 07/31/10 07:35 PM

Bill, let me add my "yes" to this great thread. The pictures and comments are excellent! When this project is done, I wonder if you'd be willing to start another note on how you put the pictures/notes together for posting. I'll bet there's a place here where that's explained, but doubt that I'm the only one who could benefit from your instruction. I really like the large, well photographed step-by-step presentation, and appreciate your sense of humor, too. Thanks!!

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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: oakey]
      #4984631 - 07/31/10 11:36 PM

oakey said:

yes you can replicate the finnish its called wrinkle paint just google it one co is plastikote.com avalible from some auto parts stores.



Sweet, thanks oakey and SceneryMaker. I never thought to look before, but I found a Krylon alternative in the automotive section of the hardware and paint store I go to. It's called wrinkled black... duh. I picked up a can, plus two other possible colors in the regular rattlecan cabinet, and did a color test when I got home. The two photos below show the following three colors, L-R: Rustoleum Black Night Metallic, Rustoleum Hammered Black, and VHT High Temperature Wrinkle Plus Black. The wrinkled is generally intended for automotive engine parts, so I would guess it's pretty durable. But does anyone have any experience or thoughts as to how it wears? It looks great, BTW, and isn't the salt-and-pepper look that appears in the photos... just a matte black.





I don't like the hammered much at all, but the metallic black is a nice dark charcoal black and will get used at some point for sure. It would go nice on these end bells along with a gloss black center, too.

Thanks... nice find today.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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rjdankert
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Registered: 01/11/09
Posts: 246
Loc: SW Michigan
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4985121 - 08/01/10 05:11 PM

I have been following both posts. Really like the pics and detailed descriptions - thats's alot of effort.

thanks

--------------------
Bob

"A dull mind uses dull tools" - my Uncle Jim


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: rjdankert]
      #4985510 - 08/01/10 11:00 PM

Thanks Bob, glad some folks are interested.

The motor painting went pretty easily today. The wrinkle black paint for the end bells is really cool, I just hope it's durable. It definitely replicates the old WT wrinkled paint. I had already prepped the end bells and center band over the past couple of days. First I cleaned out the inside of the endbells, even though they don't get painted. A bit of hand scrubbing, particularly down into the bearing wells, got them acceptable. Then a scrub and wipedown on the outside with mineral spirits cleans and prepares the painted surfaces. They were wire-wheeled extensively a couple days ago to strip to raw cast iron.









Next up is the center section. This thing is a bit heavy, clunky, and always stays together with the sides just stuffed with paper to protect the coils and electricals, and gets taped off. Right. When I tipped it on its side one time, I heard a clunk and looked over and saw a little curved metal bar laying on the bench. Uh oh. The internal section and wiring were also sliding around inside the exterior band. Damn... again. I guess it's going to have to come apart this time, another first. It turns out the little metal piece is the bar that slips inside the outer band to provide a threaded connector for the start capacitor bracket. You can see the bar sitting in place in the second photo.





Oh well, it'll make it a little easier to paint because it's only the outer band and can be hung and rotated in place, which is harder to do when the whole thing is together. After stripping paint on a wire wheel, then wiping with mineral spirits to clean everything up, it's time to tape off the badges. Tape extra wide and cut, then roll the tape under the edges of the tags so that the sides of the tags don't get overspray.





Quick run of the threads on the little set screw holes on the endbells, and pack the holes to keep the paint out.



Ready to go. Set up in the yard again, one table for pieces that get the black wrinkle, another table for the gloss black parts. Putting each part on its own little block allows them to move around independently. The center band hangs off to the side. The endbells can be either stood on end or laid flat on the inner edge.





A coat of primer on everything, using Rustoleum Rusty Metal rattlecan. Note the taping job on the inner edge of the endbells... if those get any paint on the surface, they have no hope of going back together with the center section during reassembly. Also, a rolled paper sleeve goes in the shaft bore to keep paint out of there as well.







Within about 10 minutes of spraying the primer, it is dry to the touch, but is still very soft. My approach is to quickly apply a first light coat of paint at this point, then several more coats at about 10 minute intervals. That leaves half a dozen layered coats of primer and paint, all very soft, but bonding to each other. The rattlecan instructions say to reapply each next coat either within one hour or after 48 hours, so I get it all done right away. Total painting time from the application of the primer to the final (usually about fourth) coat is about an hour. Then I let it flash dry for a couple hours, bring it inside for safekeeping, and don't touch it for three days. It seems to work reasonably well. Jasper is back there again as usual, keeping an eye on my work.



Here are parts inside a couple hours later, with the wrinkled paint doing its job really nicely. I have lots of other things to work on for the next few days, so these are going to cure until probably the end of this week before getting any more attention.





I'll be ordering bearings tomorrow and working on other stuff for the rest of the week, then hope to put the motor together probably next weekend. Back to the rest of the drill press.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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K. L, McReynolds
Honored Veteran

Registered: 01/31/01
Posts: 57439
Loc: Kansas City, Kansas, USA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4985897 - 08/02/10 09:59 AM

There is another way to get bearings out of a dead end housing. It might not be the optimum way for old cast iron, however.

Find/make a flat ended rod just smaller than the inside diameter of the bearing. I've made them on a DP with round mild steel rod and a file.

Pack heavy grease(with a dose of WD-40(etc) first into the dead end housing. Place the punch in the bearing bore and hit it with a hammer.

I did blow out the housing on one old motor I was using for practice, but that was more a problem with support while hammering. (I think). And I was seeing how hard I should hit the punch--had a 5 pound maul)

Have also used a press in the same way. That---using the press---has a LOT of pucker factor and can be HUGELY dangerous. The press I used actually had an operator guard(1/4" thick steel plate) behind which the operator would stand during use.

--------------------
Beer does NOT make you fat.

It makes you LEAN.




On walls, trees, and ugly people.


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: K. L, McReynolds]
      #4999211 - 08/12/10 01:41 AM

Ok, back to the motor. Finally time to see if this thing will go back together. This is a long post that goes from start to finish on the entire assembly. Total time spent was a bit over two hours,which includes some do-over time a couple places.

The bearings came in last week from Accurate Bearing, total cost $10 shipped. One was three bucks, one was five, and two bucks postage. Quality sealed Nachi bearings made in Japan. As always, the price and service is unparalleled.

Here are the parts all ready to go.



Start by installing the new bearings. I just use a socket and mallet to drive them on, using the smallest socket that fits over the shaft so that it only engages the inner race. On the longer end, I use an extended reach socket and a piece of pipe to get the bearing all the way down to its seat.







Five minutes later, both bearings are installed.



Now a quick couple shots and brief explanation (as I understand it) of how the centrifugal switch works in these single phase motors. The contacts that are on the little brass ring, which I showed earlier during disassembly, work together with the switch assembly that is mounted on the motor shaft. In the first photo below, the contacts are closed because the spring on the switch is pressing the ring outwards, away from the rotor. This is the state when the motor is not running... the contacts are closed, prepared to pass a pulse through to the start capacitor and on to start windings.



When the motor is powered up, the start windings fire the motor and start the rotor spinning. At that point, the metal "wings" inside the switch fly open (via centrifugal force), which pulls the little plate that rests against the contact ring in towards the rotor. This opens (disengages) the start contacts, breaks the start circuit, and the run windings take over. When you turn the motor off, the rotor spins down, the centrifugal switch recesses, and the switch plate pushes the start contact back closed. This is a photo of the centrifugal switch open, with the start contacts disengaged, which is the state while the motor is running.



Back to the reassembly. In reverse order from the disassembly, we start by working on reassembling the electrical end first. This is also the end with that troublesome blind bearing well. It's a whole lot easier to work on now. With the endbell resting on end, the start contact ring gets reattached... these were those PITA machine screws that were hard to reach while the endbell was attached before. Note that in this case, there are little washers that sit between a plastic plate and the ring plate. That makes it tough to get the assembly down into the endbell without things sliding around. I put the assembly together with one screw in place and a thin handle in the other just to keep everything aligned. Screw in one screw, pull the handle out, and screw in the other.







Next, we have to put together the center armature assembly, which you'll recall fell apart accidentally earlier. Normally, I leave this together inside the band for painting. Carefully feed the motor leads back through the opening into the junction box and slide the band into place.





Oops, forgot that one wire that we had to pull out to get the end bell off. Try again.



So now the endbell is back tethered to the armature by that wire. Gotta work with it that way from now on. I could not begin to feed the two wires that run off to the capacitor through the really tight grommet that I had already reinstalled in the endbell as seen a few photos earlier. After several futile attempts, time to give up and just get rid of the grommet. I'll wrap them in electrical tape later to provide protection.



Now to put the endbell in place. Remember those little alignment marks that were step #1 way back at the beginning? They matter now.



While we're at it, let's make sure the tie rod hole is perfectly aligned as well.



The armature is slipping around a little bit because of the little plate that fell out, so let's anchor things down by reinstalling the plate and the capacitor bracket.





The rotor shaft will fit in through the main housing from the other open end, with the bearing going all the way through the contact ring and into that blind bearing well on the far end. You can't see what's going on, but the fit is tight so it just sort of wiggles/snaps into place eventually.



The other end bell, which slips over the drive shaft, gets two flat washers and a spring washer inside the bearing well. Then it just slips onto the shaft and slides into place.





Stand the motor on end and gently tap the second endbell into place. Again, the alignment marks help make sure you get it right. This motor's pretty easy because of the feet in the endbell castings, but many motors are simply round endbells, so the marks are even more important. Note that if the painting and taping was done well, the endbells should pretty much slip into place with some gentle tapping and pressure. You should not have to use the tie rods and nuts to pull them together... if that's the case, it's generally a good idea to take it back apart and clean the intersecting surfaces further. Once all four tie rods are installed and tightened down, the motor shaft should turn freely by hand.





OK, time to deal with the capacitor. I don't know if it matters which of the two wires go to which terminal, and I forgot to mark them back when I unsoldered them. So before soldering them back into place, I do a quick test with some spare wire connectors between the leads and the cap terminals. This should also tell me whether the motor actually will work or not, before I go to the trouble of soldering in the leads.



Using my little motor tester switch that gets alligator clipped to the j-box wiring, the motor fires right up. Yippee, yahoo! Very nice.



So time to solder the cap leads and finish up.



After everything is tidied up, the cap reinstalled in place, etc., the final thing I do is clear-coat the tags. This is just a quick tape and spray with a clear acrylic like Krylon. I use an acrylic from the auto parts section at the hardware.



Fifteen minutes later it is dry to the touch, we pull off the tape, and take the final shots of the finished motor.





The wrinkle finish paint for the endbells worked absolutely great and is the perfect match for the original WT paint design. The main tag got a little deteriorated as I was cleaning it up prior to painting, but it's still in very good condition. The motor purrs like a kitten and is ready for installation once I get the drill press done.

Comments welcomed, hope you got something out of this. Thanks for following along and for all the tips. This is a major, major relief to have this thing back working again.

Bill.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Bob Vaughan
Member

Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 936
Loc: Roanoke VA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: TK'sDust]
      #4999266 - 08/12/10 06:16 AM

Motors of that vintage and type are particularly fussy to restore. That's about as good of a photo essay as one can get. You overcame a lot of existing condition problems not always found on electric motor rebuilds. Outstanding! Bookmarked it.

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oakey
Member

Registered: 02/01/10
Posts: 1154
Loc: mich.thumb
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Bob Vaughan]
      #4999641 - 08/12/10 10:39 AM

Bill
all i can say is wow very well done I to love restoring stuff and your pictorial is realy great that motor is as nice as any thing that ive seen
----------------------------------------
Sam


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Cargo Pilot ™
Senor Lavanderia Rey

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 15844
Loc: Res. Mgr. - Charlie's Gump Bin
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #4999702 - 08/12/10 11:08 AM

Well done and thanks for the effort in these threads!


Added to favorites.

--------------------
If obesity is a disease, I'm a medical lab's wet dream. - Garden Gnome

Don't try to suck me into your lunatic vortex. You're a nut job. - Spoke to RKM 2/27/13


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bj²
Gwoine Fishin/forgot bait

Registered: 01/30/04
Posts: 6217
Loc: North Alabama
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5000271 - 08/12/10 03:57 PM

Bravo!

I have a feeling this one will be bumped each year.


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TDKPE
Poindexter

Registered: 10/15/02
Posts: 10073
Loc: Rochester, NY, USA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5000286 - 08/12/10 04:05 PM

Nice job on the rebuild, and especially on the documentation. One of the best I've ever seen.

--------------------
Tom

"The farther back you can look, the farther forward you are likely to see"
Winston Churchill




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brentcz
Member

Registered: 10/17/05
Posts: 120
Loc: CA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5000298 - 08/12/10 04:16 PM

excellent tutorial, fantastic pictures, great use of on-hand materials for seating bearings. Thanks for sharing. Your efforts are appreciated. Now on to hooking that beautiful motor onto the main attraction - the drill press.

brent cannady


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Bob Vaughan]
      #5000383 - 08/12/10 05:44 PM

Bob Vaughan said:

Motors of that vintage and type are particularly fussy to restore... You overcame a lot of existing condition problems not always found on electric motor rebuilds.



Thanks folks. Bob is right... this one ended up being about as problematic/complex as any (not that there are that many) that I've ever done. All the more surprising because the external condition upon arrival looked and ran about as nice as something this old ever gets. It just goes to show that you never know about something until you open it up.

This definitely wasn't a one-hour clean up and bearing change project like you sometimes find. There were several notable hassles that I don't recall ever having to deal with before:

- the bearing in the blind well
- the cap wires that come through an endbell casting
- having to pull the starter lead out of the j-box
- having the center band come loose

But it also shows that even something with that level of challenge and complexity can still be done with some attention and care. And the end product is way, way worth it, since these are such nice motors. LOML saw it when done and was stunned, even after having seen quite a few of other motors and such before.

Much appreciated.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Warptboard
Member

Registered: 01/12/07
Posts: 1281
Loc: Minnehaha Creek, MN
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5000768 - 08/12/10 10:07 PM

I enjoyed this thread! Thank you Skizzo

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Buckaroo
Missed it by >< much

Registered: 02/25/05
Posts: 6031
Loc: Amana, Iowa(sort of)
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5000796 - 08/12/10 10:33 PM

Outstanding Bill! , and thanks for that shot of the centrifugal switch. I'm pretty sure my plate bypasses that switch so I'm not sure how it even runs, but it does. I have more investigating to do but thanks for steering me on the right path.
Love the end bells. Now all I have to do is find some of that VHT High Temperature Wrinkle Plus Black.
Excellent write up.

--------------------
Buck

Business Meetings - None of us is as dumb as all of us.


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
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Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Buckaroo]
      #5000864 - 08/12/10 11:35 PM

Buckaroo said:

thanks for that shot of the centrifugal switch. I'm pretty sure my plate bypasses that switch so I'm not sure how it even runs, but it does.



So this is the shot of yours, right?



I suppose it's possible that the fiber plate on the switch might be worn down to the point that it (or part of it) go inside the brass contact ring. But if even a little bit of the plate catches the brass ring, it's likely to exert enough pressure to close the contacts when it spins down. If it is smaller OD than the ID of the brass ring, I'd bet you could figure out a way with tape or something similar to build up the perimeter of the fiber plate so that it doesn't get inside the contact ring.

That wrinkle paint is the bees' knees, eh? I had no idea such a good replica would be available... I just found it at my local chain Borg-substitute hardware store. Good luck.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Buckaroo
Missed it by >< much

Registered: 02/25/05
Posts: 6031
Loc: Amana, Iowa(sort of)
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5000880 - 08/13/10 12:20 AM

that's the one ....when I first took it apart.
I haven't cracked it back open yet but IIRC, it's almost like that plate was cut out of the one below. It is smaller diameter than the switch but maybe it's offset enough that it hits the ring.
Might even be just hitting it on one side Didn't think about that.

That paint is awesome. I still haven't painted my bells and I was half thinking about applying it in a "stipple" fashion ( my wife was watching some decorating show where they were doing that) I wasn't really looking forward to trying that.

is this the stuff? Looks like it's a good choice for the application.

--------------------
Buck

Business Meetings - None of us is as dumb as all of us.


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Buckaroo]
      #5000884 - 08/13/10 12:32 AM

That looks exactly like it, IIRC. I think there are different colors, so be sure to find wrinkle black. Like somebody upthread said, try it on a practice piece first. Per the instructions, it takes a fairly heavy coat, applied in layers, timed fairly close together. I've had other paints crinkle on me by accident, usually because it was applied to thickly. This says to do that on purpose.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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SteveV.
minute of fame

Registered: 12/17/07
Posts: 182
Loc: Texas
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5003558 - 08/15/10 11:19 AM

I have really enjoyed reading this and the DP post Bill. Very informative and great pictures for those of us who are visual learners.

Steve


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Buckaroo
Missed it by >< much

Registered: 02/25/05
Posts: 6031
Loc: Amana, Iowa(sort of)
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5018096 - 08/25/10 03:06 PM

Found some of the VHT today. Was at autozone trying to find bulbs for some trailer lights so I walked by the paint section and it was right there.
Hope I have half as good of results as you did.
Thanks for all the info.

--------------------
Buck

Business Meetings - None of us is as dumb as all of us.


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NBeener
Member

Registered: 10/04/10
Posts: 290
Loc: Northern Colorado
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Buckaroo]
      #5290688 - 02/17/11 09:25 AM

Truly an excellent tutorial. Many thanks.

I'm nearly finished with rebuilding the 1/4 HP motor on my 1956 DeWalt MBF RAS.

I'm replacing the circuit breaker, and soldering new leads on the end of the winding.

I'm also (rather related) replacing both runs of power cord with a cannibalized 14/3 extension cord.

Incidentally, I think you got lucky. My cord side bearing came out of the end bell with liberal use of PB Blaster.

What did NOT happen easily was ... removing the back bearing from the armature. I think it had galled in place, over the years.

Ruined two (cheap) chisels, AND exhausted my (what I thought was significant) supply of curse words.

But ... in the end ....

NBeener: 1
Bearing: 0

For the record, I had a local motor shop give me a price on re-winding the motor. Because of the cost of copper, they guessed about $700.

Guess what I'm NOT having them do


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Charles Jackson III
Future cabinetmaker

Registered: 08/19/02
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Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5291760 - 02/17/11 06:07 PM

Nice job on the motor.

--------------------
My Boss is a Jewish Carpenter!


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Tapper
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Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5292154 - 02/17/11 11:10 PM

Wonderful job and great pics and documentation of the process - I thoroughly enjoyed it! I have a 5 HP Dewalt three phase motor to break down and install new bearings in, coming up (which will be a "first" for me) and this was a good primer.

Doug


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Tapper]
      #5448272 - 05/31/11 10:45 PM

Bump to go with its companion thread.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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BaileyNo5
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Registered: 11/29/09
Posts: 2859
Loc: Calgary but confess I'm Okie
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5448293 - 05/31/11 11:28 PM

skizzo said:


Bump to go with its companion thread.



Thanks for the bump, it brought the thread to my attention. Great rebuild and really nice pics and documentation!

--------------------
True power makes no noise. Albert Schweitzer - It's obvious he was referring to hand tools


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MrMhor
Member

Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 1184
Loc: Rockford, IL
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: BaileyNo5]
      #5756993 - 01/08/12 07:52 AM

Needed to reference this thread again, so figured I'd bump it.

Cheers,
Andrew


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Matt42
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Registered: 01/23/05
Posts: 804
Loc: Maricopa County, AZ
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: MrMhor]
      #5757141 - 01/08/12 10:25 AM

MrMhor said:


Needed to reference this thread again, so figured I'd bump it.

Cheers,
Andrew



And thanks for doing so. It's timely for me. I need to rebuild a U.S. made 220 volt evaporative cooler motor that lasted 19 years. I think that it just needs new bronze bushings. New motors--even from A.O. Smith are from China. The old one can be maintained and lubricated.

--------------------
Life's like an hourglass glued to a table.


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Matt42]
      #5886005 - 04/13/12 12:11 AM

anudder bump to keep this one with the other thread that came back up.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Barry
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Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5886648 - 04/13/12 02:08 PM

This was fun to follow. Not quite as good as being there and getting immersed in that aroma of WD-40, but close.

I used wrinkle finish many times in the distant past and remember it was fascinating to watch that paint dry. And back then I even had a life.

--------------------
Itshardtoputspacesinbetweenyourwordswithouttheuseofyourthumbs


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timo1112
Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 1
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5938895 - 05/29/12 04:56 PM

Hi , glad you've kept this subject going. I stumbled onto this site via and internet search concerning a walker turner motor that I have removed from my TA1180B table saw, in an effort to find how to repair so that I won't have to start my saw with a piece of wood to get the blade going. Long story shorter, 1 belt was gone, 1 was in shreds, and only one was left. The saw bogged down during a resaw process, and could not finish the job, so I decided, while I had the motor out, I would take it to a motor repairman to have the capacitor tested.(it would only buzz when I turned it on, thus the encouragement from a piece of wood to get the blade going. I first dismantled the motor somewhat, as the repairman said that if I had 1 free wire from the capacitor, he could test it. He did, it measured a little high, given the specs on the capacitor, and he said that probably was not the issue. I told him that I had blown a LOT of sawdust out of the motor before I brought it to him. He thought that the sawdust could likely be the reason it was buzzing but not running, and that I should clean it up as much as possible, put it back on the saw, and try it. As I was reassembling, I noticed that two springs on one side of the centrifugal mechanism were broken. Not being a motor expert, I went ahead and put the motor back together. Before I installed it, I turned it on, got up running without an issue, and when I turned it off, the rotor took 20 seconds or longer to stop rotating. Great! I thought, sounds pretty good, hooray. I turned it on a while later, and it hesitated briefly before getting up and running. Oops , darn! I put it back on the saw anyway, decided to try it. No, it wouldn't go, I couldn't even spin the blade with a piece of wood, now that I had 3 fresh belts.
I'm sure that the rotating mechanism is the problem here, the inside windings, contacts, and wires were looking pretty good.
My question is, does anyone know where I might find a surplus or new centrifugal mechanism for this motor ? I have checked with Jeff at Walker-Turner Serviced Machinery, LLC. He does not have any for the 1HP motors; only has some for the smaller motors, which have lighter weight springs. So much for making a long story short!
I really enjoyed the walker turner drill press and motor rebuild and appreciate the time and effort you took, Skizzo, to do it and to share it. It turned out fantastic, especially the motor, and made me realize how much I'd rather save this old motor than replace it, unless I end up with no alternative. I have a new found appreciation for my vintage tools, which before, were just ones I could afford rather than new ones. Any help or advice would be much appreciated!! Thanks!
Quote:




Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. Plato

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K. L, McReynolds
Honored Veteran

Registered: 01/31/01
Posts: 57439
Loc: Kansas City, Kansas, USA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5940229 - 05/30/12 10:58 PM

Another wat to remove a bearing from a blind casting.

Get/make a hardwood or steel punch the sane size(.003" smaller) than the inside race diameter. Get a blob of thick grease. Pack the grease in the bearing hole and fill the cavity behind the bearing.

Stick the punch in the bearing, tap with a hammer. Non compressible grease forces the bearing out.

--------------------
Beer does NOT make you fat.

It makes you LEAN.




On walls, trees, and ugly people.


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stronics
Member

Registered: 05/03/03
Posts: 229
Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5941609 - 06/01/12 06:17 AM

Well reading this thread has been the most enjoyable time I have spent in a long time. Absolutely loved every facet of it. Amazing.
Thanks,
David


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jgourlay
Just Promoted to troublemaker

Registered: 12/06/02
Posts: 10676
Loc: Houston, Texas
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #5941788 - 06/01/12 08:58 AM

Wow...thanks so much for posting this. I have almost exactly the same motor on my lathe. It runs fine, but after 45 minutes of solid run time, it starts getting really, really warm.

Should I take it apart and start cleaning up? Maybe repack the bearing grease?

--------------------
MAKE: Void your warranty, violate a user agreement, fry a circuit, blow a fuse, poke an eye out... www.makezine.com

No Good Deed Goes Unpunished



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Buckaroo
Missed it by >< much

Registered: 02/25/05
Posts: 6031
Loc: Amana, Iowa(sort of)
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: K. L, McReynolds]
      #6231057 - 01/21/13 06:05 PM

K. L, McReynolds said:


Another wat to remove a bearing from a blind casting.

Get/make a hardwood or steel punch the sane size(.003" smaller) than the inside race diameter. Get a blob of thick grease. Pack the grease in the bearing hole and fill the cavity behind the bearing.

Stick the punch in the bearing, tap with a hammer. Non compressible grease forces the bearing out.




Glad I found this thread. I did another WT motor this weekend and didn't have my blind puller along. Couldnt find a dowel the right size so I used a drill bit shaft.....using a block of wood to not hurt the point when I hammered on it.

--------------------
Buck

Business Meetings - None of us is as dumb as all of us.


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skizzo
Member

Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Buckaroo]
      #6290509 - 03/06/13 02:08 PM

Bump to continue along with its companion drill press thread.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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HelpMeSpock
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Registered: 08/22/13
Posts: 4
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #6478694 - 08/23/13 09:52 AM

skizzo said:


Bump to continue along with its companion drill press thread.




I have an old GE motor. I thought it needed a new cord. But when I took it apart I see it needs more than that. It has 5 wires (black, green, yellow, blue, and brown) and a 4 post terminal plate. The number 1 terminal post is missing. I'm not sure how they should to connect to a new cord. I asked around town and searched online, nothing definite, then your thread came up in a search and I was so impressed I had to register here so I can contact you. I'm sure you are the guy who can help. Will you help Skizzo?


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K. L, McReynolds
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Registered: 01/31/01
Posts: 57439
Loc: Kansas City, Kansas, USA
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #6478900 - 08/23/13 11:57 AM

Without reading the entire thread, there is another way to get a sealed bearing out of a closed housing.

All that is needed is a metal(or hard wood) punch just smaller than the inside diameter of the bearing , some gear grease, and a hammer.

Pack the grease in the cavity behind the bearing, insert the punch and hit with hammer.

--------------------
Beer does NOT make you fat.

It makes you LEAN.




On walls, trees, and ugly people.


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danceswithticks
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Registered: 01/02/10
Posts: 216
Loc: SW Michigan
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: K. L, McReynolds]
      #6479220 - 08/23/13 03:53 PM

Thanks for your rebuilding threads. Almost gives me the courage to tackle my own project.

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skizzo
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Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 5552
Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: HelpMeSpock]
      #6479497 - 08/23/13 10:29 PM

I'm far from the only person who can try to help. But regardless, the first place to start is to show some photos of your motor. It would be helpful if you could show the data plate (if there is one), plus the wires and the terminal plate. We really need a starting point to see what you're working with.

As an aside, could you please start a new thread about your motor so that it doesn't take this one off into a different discussion about a different item? We'll be glad to see if we can get you back and running.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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skizzo
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Registered: 07/26/05
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Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #6617905 - 01/01/14 11:31 PM

Bump for a new year.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Tear out
Member

Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 448
Loc: West Des Moines, Iowa
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #6618485 - 01/02/14 02:02 PM

Bill,

You pointed me towards your drill press post several weeks back, and I first saw this thread referenced in that thread. I learned a lot by going through it, and I bookmarked it. You did an excellent job in the documentation and I thank you for that.

I opened up my 3/4 hp Delta Marathon motor (for the 17" drill press) yesterday to clean it out and replace the bearings, and fix a loose wire. I started a thread about it on the electrical forum at owwm.

I wish I had thought to re-read your motor thread as a refresher before opening my motor. I forgot to match-mark the end bells on the center housing! I also found that some of the questions I had posted on my owwm thread are answered right here in your thread. Using the socket to install the bearings on the shaft is ingenious.

I was going to pull the bearings out of the end bells tonight to take final measurements for re-ordering, but I think I will delay that and verify I can reassemble before further disassembly, and then match-mark the pieces.

One detail that is not clear to me - I can see that the bearings are pressed onto the shaft. Are the bearings also pressed into the end bells, or is it more of a snug fit into the end bells? I have been struggling with envisioning this part of the reassembly process.

Thanks.

--------------------
Steve


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skizzo
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Registered: 07/26/05
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Loc: San Jose
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: Tear out]
      #6618583 - 01/02/14 03:08 PM

I saw your motor post and realized much of what you said there related back to this thread. It's what led me to come back here and bump these two again. Bearings typically are not pressed into their end bell housings, should be a snug slip fit. It's usually easier getting new bearings into a freshly cleaned up housing than it is getting the stuck old bearing out in the first place. Once you have your bearings pressed onto the motor shaft/rotor, the end bell should be able to slip onto it with some light taps. There are some instance though (just had one this weekend) where the bearing needs to be installed in the end bell and then locked in place with a screw, which means the endbell (with bearing) has to then be pressed onto the bearing. I think that was Mike's point in your OWWM discussion.

--------------------
Bill
Know, think, choose, do -- Ender's Shadow


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Tear out
Member

Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 448
Loc: West Des Moines, Iowa
Re: Restoring an Old Electrical Motor new [Re: skizzo]
      #6618626 - 01/02/14 03:41 PM

Thanks Bill.

Now that I know that the bearings are just snug fit in the end bells, everything makes much more sense, and I understand Mike's suggested sequence.

In truth, before opening my motor I did think about reading through your thread again - but I was anxious to get started and I reasoned that the two motors were different makes and similarities would be minimal. Well, I was wrong about that!

--------------------
Steve


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